RFK pressured CDC to dismiss career scientists until they backed his views, ousted director says

A slashing of staff and silencing of career scientists is undermining public health and putting Americans at risk, former leaders of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention told Congress on Wednesday. 

Throughout the Senate hearing, the former head of CDC and its chief medical officer derided Health and Human Service Department Secretary Robert Kennedy for compromising scientific integrity and injecting political goals into scientific work. Susan Monarez, the President Trump appointed and Senate confirmed former CDC director, reiterated to the Senate Health, Education, Labor and Pensions Committee that Kennedy fired her over two major disagreements: Monarez refused to pre-accept forthcoming decisions from the agency’s vaccine advisory panel, as well as to fire career employees without cause. 

Kennedy met with Monarez and made those demands on Aug. 25, shortly before she was fired just 29 days after her confirmation, the former director said. She told senators the secretary’s requests were “inconsistent with my oath of office and the ethics required of a public official.” Monarez emphasized she was open to signing off on changes to the vaccine schedule for children, but had to first evaluate the evidence that precipitated the alterations. 

She added, however, she had “no basis to fire scientific experts.” Those staffers were responsible for vaccine policy, Monarez said. Kennedy previously fired all existing members of the Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices and installed his own nominees, many of whom have sparked pushback over their lack of scientific backgrounds. 

The secretary went on to tell Monarez she would need to continue firing career staff until officials were in place who would sign off on Kennedy’s preferred outcomes, the former director said. 

“I needed to fire them, promote the next group, and continue to do so until I got to an organization that was compliant with my demands,” Monarez said. 

Debra Houry, who served as CDC’s chief medical officer until she resigned with other top officials after Monarez’s firing, also testified at Wednesday's hearing

“I resigned because CDC leaders were reduced to rubber stamps, supporting policies not based in science, and putting American lives at risk,” Houry said. “Secretary Kennedy censored CDC science, politicized its processes and stripped leaders of independence. I could not and good conscience remain under those conditions.” 

CDC has shed one-quarter of its staff since Trump took office, much of which was driven by mass layoffs of 2,400 employees. A fraction of those workers have since been recalled, but Houry warned the reductions are having significant impacts. 

“For the next type of pandemic, a novel pathogen, some of the staff cuts we have faced, we have less ready responders,” Houry said. “We have less visibility into global pathogens at this time.” 

Kennedy has made clear his distrust of career CDC employees, something he reiterated in his August conversation with Monarez. 

The secretary “emphasized that CDC employees were horrible people,” Monarez recalled. “He said that CDC employees were killing children and they don't care.” 

She added that on Aug. 19, she received a directive from HHS leadership that political appointees must approve of any CDC policy. Kennedy subsequently directed Monarez to no longer speak to any career employee, the former director alleged. 

Monarez’s allegations against Kennedy, which the secretary largely denied in a previous hearing, generated some bipartisan concern. 

“Turmoil at the top of the nation's top public health agency is not good for the health of the American people,” said Sen. Bill Cassidy, R-La., who chairs the HELP Committee. He added the hearing was just the first step in learning the truth of what happened. 

Sens. Susan Collins, R-Maine, and Lisa Murkowski, R-Alaska, both said they were distressed by HHS’ political leadership sidelining career staff. Monarez agreed, saying it “really concerns” her due the highly technical nature of the decisions being made. 

“If you don't have the commensurate skill sets or the ability to ask the right questions, and you're willing to sign off on decisions that are not made with the best available data and evidence,” Monarez said. “It does put at risk our children. It puts at risk others who need these vaccines, and it takes us into a very dangerous place in public health.”

Sen. Bernie Sanders, I-Vt., said Monarez was fired for standing up to Kennedy’s “dangerous agenda.” 

“She took the radical position that she wanted to examine the scientific facts before drawing conclusions,” Sanders said. “I would hope that that is the very least we could expect from any public health official in the United States.”

Monarez noted she was told that not only did Kennedy tell her not to talk to career staff, but also banned her from speaking to members of Congress after she reached out to lawmakers over her concern over scientific integrity. 

“He was very concerned that I had spoken to members of Congress, and he told me I was never to do it again,” Monarez said.